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10.16.2004
Apparently - umbraco doesn't suck! Permanent link to this post with (10 comments )

Jeffrey Veen has written a blogpost about why "Open source content management software sucks". After reading it I'm very proud to be one of the makers of open source content management who wonder if what he writes really is true. I had an idea that most of the systems out there aren't to well designed or aren't meant to be used by anybody but the developers who makes them. But apparently he's right. That is at least until umbraco came! I'll answer why umbraco doesn't suck by using the reasons Veen gives in the blogpost:

Make it easy to install
Umbraco comes with an installation guide and can be installed in less than 10 minutes. But because of security issues it cannot be installed and configured from a browser alone. Settings like the connection to the database and file-security settings should be done manually. However there are plans creating an installer which will take care of the most. Prior to that we'll create a validation script that can be called from a browser. It will tell you whether or not all of the above settings are working. If not - it will tell you how to solve it. Not an A+ solution, but getting closer!


Make it easy to get started
Umbraco actually comes with a test-site when installed. It will give you an idea how things could be done in umbraco and will give editors the opportunity to instantly create a web page, add styles and much more. Designers will learn how templates and styles (css) are working in umbraco and developers it will get a chance to look at how to create functionality like menus, lists and rss-feeds using macros.


Knight Rider: The sample site that comes with the default umbraco installation



Write task-based documentation first.
This is an excellent point and an issue that we're working hard on solving at umbraco - the company behind the software. It takes a lot of time and cost a lot of money doing it the right way, and will be a product that only will be available through a fee. But we have done great efforts in making umbraco really easy to use by using existing application metafors like tree-views, toolbars and we have put tons of hours into the custom build web based WYSIWYG editor that comes with context-sensitive menus, integrated style-picker, integrated picture insertion from media archieve and a lot of other features:


The build-in web based editor in umbraco. The content of a document can be organized in tabs for a clearer view.



Separate the administration of the CMS from the editing and managing of content.
Umbraco is build of by a number of sections which users can be given access to. This way it's really easy to separate the administration of the CMS from the editing part. The administration can also easily be separated so administrators can edit the user-part, designers edit the styles and templates and developers edit the core part of the settings and functionality.

Users of a public web site should never - never - be presented with a way to log into the CMS.
Agree, amen! The subject as caused some confusion because people are mixing a lot of different kinds of cms like wikis, blogs and other very specialized cms. I'm assuming that Veen are talking about CMS' for editing websites and there's absolutely no reason that people should see a link to an administration. Henri Berguis from Midgaard project claims that "maintainers of small business websites like to have the login link handy so they don't have to remember or bookmark it". So because one single person might forget the login link or don't want to bookmark it, everybody visiting the site should be confused over an "edit this page" button? I hope he's joking!

umbraco only shows the content that is written by you, your designers or your developers using the template-technology. umbraco never writes any html by it self and this way you won't see any "edit this page" buttons. However if you really want one, it can be inserted into your templates. A better solution is the possibility of showing the button if you're logged in and actually have editing-rights to the specific page. It's possible too.

Stop it with the jargon already.
At umbraco we really try to have a simple terminology that people either know or can figure out. We use terms like "document", "media", "style", "template", "document or media type" and so on. The most confusing term we have is "macro", but it's inspired by the terminology already known from word processors and refers to the way things can be automated in umbraco. Macros could be used to automatically create navigation, breadcrumbs, and lists or be used to integrate your own .NET controls.

Why do you insist Web sites have "columns"?
We don't! With templates in umbraco you're 100% in charge over the design of your website. The template consists of your html, xml or any other text-based format that your output should be. Inside the template you have the possibility of inserting a range of five umbraco-tags where you want the edited content or navigation to be. Typically you just copy your html from Dreamweaver, GoLive or your favorite text editor and replace the "Lorem Ipsum" texts with umbraco tags. You actually don't even have to know these tags - the web based template editor in umbraco features buttons and user interface to insert these specialized tags.


The web based template editor in umbraco with online help and buttons for inserting umbraco tags...


So what are you waiting for Veen - go to the umbraco.org website and start downloading now?


10 Comment(s)...


Comments:
Well... bring on the demo! Does it run on apache with a mySql database or do I have to change my hostingprovider? Gimme the specs please!
 
I agree that there are a few CMSs that come close to yours. But definetely an open source CMS mostly succeeds on open source infrastructere. your software does not support linux (it should be php or perl etc.). so, imho, if you make transition to LAMP system it's best way. i really like to use on my main site and my customers' but impossible because i'm on linux.
 
Grobbo it's on windows and requires .net framework. and i also see a dll file in the zip.
 
A decent open source .net CMS!?!!!? Miracles will never cease ;-)
 
Oh yes -> umbraco is based on .NET and requieres SQL Server. So it's not based on open source infrastructure. We're planning to support other data-providers in the next version but it's *only* on the planning stage.

We've chosen the .NET platform because we think it's brilliant, and of course you can create open source software even if you're using platforms that aren't. We haven't tested umbraco on Mono but chances are big that it will work :-)

And as a side notice - the download on umbraco.org does not contain source. We'll release it when we release the Release Candidate mid november. If you really wanna have our current solution files, then send me a mail!
 
The disease in any society is an attachment to an ethos.
You are naive to think that the meaning of open source means that it HAS to run on open source systems.

Linux doesn't run on top of open free systems. You have to pay for your hardware. I personally think that .NET is superior to any programming environment available in Linux. If it so happens that the system works well on Microsoft, then the system should be built on microsoft.

Fundamentalism fucks up society from every angle. I praise Umbraco for taking Open Source in a direction that I haven't yet seen and creating a decent piece of software that doesn't suck.
 
The comment that all open source CMSes should run on LAMP is severely misguided. Obviously that person has never worked in a company where "we use MS servers exclusively" is a top-down decision. When a department needs to launch an internal or external project in such a company, contrary to popular belief, there's often minimual (or no!) budget to purchase a CMS. And buying a server to run LAMP isn't an option either, even if the budget were there.

So, what's the option? Use a lame Dreamweaver templated site, install an open source portal system that doesn't really need the need, or roll-your-own CMS. All not great ideas.

I'm glad Umbraco is available on .NET. I'm going to evaluate it later this month. I'm guessing if it's halfway decent and a better fit than DNN/Rainbow are, it will find a large receptive audience among the tens of thousands of MS developers who can't afford $1,000-$50,000+ price tags for software to manage their website.

I'm not even going to get into the weak "add-on" hack that I think is PHP "object-oriented" programming. Or the relative ease of admining a Linux vs. Win server for part-time admins. Because in many companies such technical decisions are overriden further up the management chain.

Moving forward with Umbraco development, if you can get Mono compatibility and add a Firebird DB data layer, you'll get all the advantages of advanced .NET programming AND be able to run software that's 100% free, from OS to browser. That would be sweet, and completely eliminate this silly argument...

PS: Regarding source code, a DLL is fine with me, as long as you have a fabulous API and add-in structure for adding functionality, beyond additional custom content modules. That's something the DNN/RB competitors lack.
 
I've got Umbraco installed, and I like a lot of things about it. As far as I can tell, some features
are either not implemented yet, or not implemented in the english-beta that I have. I'm not bothered by seeing half the admin in Danish. I hear that in
a few days they'll be releasing the latest version which will be both english and danish.

I'm building a list of wishes, possible bugs, and questions to shoot them.

Mostly, I like the fact of separation of the site from the site tools, unlimited templating, and the flexible views of the HTML. Thus my site can have a non-membership face, or I can put a login button on the site. Some of the bugs I'm experiencing are preventing me testing all the features, so I'm hoping the release comes soon. Or perhaps these bugs are due to a
faulty installation on my part.

I do hope Niels can open an english-speaking forum really soon!

Here's my wish list, some of which are probably implemented, but just not
obvious to me:

WISH LIST

1.. Mouse-hover text tooltips on the toolbar
2.. Resizable screen for "Edit HTML" code view (There is also a WYSIWYG and a tags view)
3.. News Macro: Need to be able to indicate order of display (sort="alphabetical", sort="date" sort="descending", sort="ascending", etc.)
4.. News Macro: Need to be able to limit date range based on creation date (e.g. last 30 days, or between 7 days and 60 days)
5.. News Macro: Need to be able to edit creation date.
6.. Renaming control panel directory should be doable through a single admin setting which will rewrite configs and other hard-wired references.
(Templates can be manually updated if there are login links)
7.. Login Welcome screen: I want to put content on that welcome screen.
8.. Need a logout button for the control panel!!
9.. Need choice to expire the control panel login as soon as the browser closes. Currently only allows for time-delimited open sessions (cookies)
10.. News Macro: Default install should have example of news archive so site creators don't have to guess how to set one up. Are there news categories, or is each category treated as a separate news strip? Is there a way to blend all the news categories into a single display (such as the home page), and sort them with the above sorts? How about dynamically producing a link list of all the news macro instances?
11.. I'd like to have a global "publish" button (since "save" and "publish" are not the same).
12.. Article: Do not publish before - date (overrides all macro time delimiters)
13.. Settings: Ability to create custom fields for content properties screen. (e.g. checkbox for "edited", "reviewed", "approved". True/false
data will be preserved when the content is updated. Data can be used in macros.

That's it for now.
 
Of course you can develop open source products on top of closed ones, but it puts both your own product and it's customers in a worse situation than without, in terms of exchanging certain components, or heavily modify it's initial intended uses.

"Linux doesn't run on top of open free systems. You have to pay for your hardware."

- Well here you talk about free as in no money, I'm much more concerned with closed hardware standards (i.e. Apple hardware) where you are suddenly forced to retreat your development because you need a change built into a closed component (be it hard or software etc.).

Until a full .NET is available from other vendors than Microsoft, I see no reason for tying up your own legs by using it for anything above hobby, training.. No offense to your product or the efficiency of Microsoft .NET platform, I just mind the legal stuff in the matter.

Best regards Fini A. Alring
 
Where is the source for umbraco??????
 
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